1.7.1.x Feedback

[NiteHawk]

I know there are some changes with the way some things work, for example, rehiding delay could be tweaked to be lower etc if it's too much.

I also know MR may be a problem. I think the lower MR but higher passive damage resistance will help solve the issue of people running around with huge MR. (I.E. More damage negated per spell that goes through). Please let us try to balance it but we need more feedback on it.

Also need feedback on the staff weapons plus spell damage. You can test ORIGINAL damage with a brill level 25 staff. I believe a brill level 25 to a radiant orange with 3% extra spell damage is like 10-15 more damage though, if that. PLEASE TEST IT BEFORE HAND. Damage was not UPPED to mega amounts/etc. It's a small bonus!

There might be a few things like adding MR back to ninjas, I'm not sure yet. Other things to do with the update can be here as well. Maybe the sorc pet for finding people isn't also needed either now.

Please give some good feedback. TEST IT MORE THEN ONCE AND OTHERS! It will help instead of sea-sawing the issues back and forth. Thanks.

[NiteHawk]

MR changes didn't actually go in. Rethinking it a bit before I add it. Thanks.

[NiteHawk]

Anyways. Saurian and Drake could prob do with +1 end again. Maybe something else too, we'll have to see for all the low wis races.

MR is sitting at this:

Base 28% resistance. 4% wisdom per point over 10. Passive spell damage negation is 0.5% per point.
So someone with 20 wis will get: 68% resistances and 5% passive negation.
Someone with 18 wis will get: 60% resistances and 4% passive negation.
Someone with 12 wis will get: 36% resistances and 1% passive negation.

The original idea was to make MR a bit lower and raise passive spell damage. Base of 30%, 3% wisdom per point over 10. Passive spell damage negation at 1.5% per point.
So someone with 20 wis will get: 60% resistances and 15% passive negation.
Someone with 18 wis will get: 54% resistances and 12% passive negation.
Someone with 12 wis will get: 36% resistances and 3% passive negation.

Generally this is partially why damage is a little higher with spells too right now.

[Terron]

rng luck trumps most stats.

gnome ninja with 23 wisdom (before nerf) lost fights to every single dm ever, and lost to 17/20 chanters. i dont think small amounts of negation are going to help gnomes or elementals stand out against casters unless they get 20% on top as a racial bonus.

saurians drakes and horcs need something to make them trample dark elves goblins lings and dwarves as fast as chanters kill the horcs and lizards. eles and gnomes melee classes should be able to withstand caster armies because they cannot ever kill them with the low damage.

that being said its not going to magically get fixed by overhauling the mr system. the stats on each race arent balanced so individual racial and/or class bonuses/penalties need to be used to balance this. u can just say well wisdom is bad now mmkay and expect a elf to feel less pain than a goblin. the elf is actually getting even worse where the goblin has 1136 hps to live even if he gets hit. and negation on top now.
point is if the avg melee hit is 150 and it takes 13 hard swats to kill a dwarf, it should be taking 13 magical hits to kill a gnome. if u have to make gnomes negate 62.7765% magic to make this happen then thats what u have to do. need to instill penalties and bonuses on class and races to make the racial balance a linear system. then after that changing whole systems might work a bit better.

as far as the hide changes, i dunno anyone who will play one now. theres way way way too many hardcounter skills ingame to warrant needing to sit in the open after an attack and let every enemy play teeball with your face. this isnt the way to bring the slayer users back. and it seems youre just chasing a few brig users offline. we want 12 OP classes dont we? brigand was finally useful. now its just a liability again, even more than it was 3 years ago. now it has crappy armor and hide that dont work and you cant pot while hidden.

think nerfs arent the way to go, we had more players with less of these "balance updates".

log a saurian die to caster its supposed to happen sorry
log a dark elf and die to half orc its supposed to happen sorry
log a chanter and waste all your mana trying to kill a gnome or ele, its supposed to happen

think its time to get real on the character triangle

[JadeFalcon]

Yeah im going to vote with my feet for another month or so.

I agree with Piddy, there should be a rock/paper/scissor thing going on, but currently what is the use to play a low int/low wis class?
Im fine getting fried by gnomes, but now with 1600pp on me i can win exactly against no one.
- magic classes fry me, fine by me.
- healing classes make way too much damage to me, and they can wear me down. Unless i magically land 3bs in a row, they always win
- melee classes: Anything with more INT than I currently humilliates me. They hide/search me/BS me and hide again before i can fight back. So i get kicked by elf slayers and every other brig. Im not even going to get in what zerkers do to me, or cavs.

Im still pretty good at killing mort when he is afk, though.

[Terron]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2556 redirecting, but this is the major issue here.

i replied: saurians need more power and a hp drawback to set them apart. however their use of skill oriented things needs a small boost. 23 22 17 16 14 14. make this race mean again.

the issue was to balance drakes and saurians they gained 50 hps which is pretty much no change whatsoever.

obviously, when u play 1 character like JF, you are going to run into some problems. however, the race itself is pretty much limited to stupid dps, or slayers/brigs with 0 skill. the dps offer next to nothing over a goblin or dark elf, and the slayer side dont get enough benefit to matter in most situations. saurians were OP as hell before the buffs not working on multipliers era. but now that the buffs arent x4, saurian needs a little power, partly why I said the above about upping the int a couple and the str, meanwhile lowering endurance.

[Miach]

Meta has changed.

I agree it is hard to shift between meta changes due to the inflexibility of each race and class.

It has caused me to level new characters (thank you Squire event).

It can be hard for someone who only plays one character to hard counter many situations.

Saurians are good for OaD'ing, in OaDs where magic damage is not a concern.
Note that I also do not own any Saurians.

[NiteHawk]

I do agree some lower MR races need to be looked at, mainly the saurian/drake/ho races.

I'm going to probably see about adding a statistics to this before I modify anything. I probably want to see how fights are handled/what people play/etc, so I'm going to need a little bit of time to process this all first.

[daedroth]

Make stealth an INT/AGL combo.

[Terron]

theres nothing wrong with those races except a weakness to magic, which is implied when picking the race. beating around the bush if you ask me. its obvious the reason saurians and drakes arent used is because dark elves and goblins get nearly the same melee prowess and +6 wisdom/negation. there just isnt enough separation between hardcore melee and melee/mr hybrids(which also get int for free and more than 50% mr). melee/mr hybrids just arent middle of the road.