MR Changes

[NiteHawk]

THere is a big change to how MR works and it needs some heavy testing. I doubt it is 100% right now and it might be too strong, or not strong enough. Most values I can now change without having to restart the server, so we'll try to balance that out now.
Pierce bonuses have been removed from staff weapons, we are going to do something different with weapons and give them damage bonuses instead. The damage bonus isn't in yet.

Please note: MR might now be fine, but damage might need tweaking now. We need to test it anyways.

So MR is based on the following, wisdom, class, and race. Wisdom is a big part of it still, and class/race are smaller modifiers. INT does not effect how well you pierce now. The pierce rate is based on simply your class/race/MR for a static value. This means INT effects duration, damage/heal, or how well a spell debuffs/buffs someone. So having a caster that is not a GNOME is now a thing, though if you want maximum damage and highest MR you would go for GNOME still. I can see other races with 20/21 int being a thing now though.

On top of this, wisdom passive damage removal was changed as well. It was far too much with high wisdom (something like 20-25% WITH 70% resistances is insane!). Wisdom damage negation starts at 11 wisdom and goes up. This means at 10 wisdom you are taking the full damage. If for some reason you have lower, you'll be taking 'extra' damage. The damage negation only removes about 10-12% now damage with his wisdom, which I think is fair enough for now but we will see.

Goblins got a nice boost. They should now be what they look like, fighters with good MR. 17 wisdom with 20% boost grants them around the same as having 21 wisdom so they obviously get a good bang per wisdom point there.

Elementals were changed a bit. I removed their spell damage bonus and set them with lower resistances. However, this doesn't mean they have bad resistances. An elemental knight with 24 wisdom is the same around as a half-elf knight with 22 wisdom.

Druids were also lowered in the MR scale to the lowest. I know that it loosk scary, but even with the nerf they still have one of the highest MR rates because most druids will have over 20 wisdom. Please remember that having 0.95 per wisdom point for example doesn't mean you are suddenly getting 0 MR. An elemental druid with 24 wisdom probably has the same MR as a half-elf knight with 20-21 wisdom. This means though that elemntal druids while being better at physical, will be a little weaker than its counterparts, though I don't think it's enough to seriously effect them in combat, but I thought a 80% MR rate with spell negation on a race that is meant for druids mostly was simply silly and ruined other options around it.

Please remember, that MR now scales differently too. We need to test everything.

MR Values are posted in the development blog. viewtopic.php?f=10&t=93

I'll have more technical data later, heads killing though right now.

[NiteHawk]

P.S. Free reallocation will be on AGI update, not this one.

[killa]

sounds good to me.

*waits for elemental lovers to come complain*

[Lateralus]

Its only been 1 day (not even that) but wanted to give some feedback


Slayers with 10 wis no longer get hit 4/4 its more like 3/4 or 2.5/4 even (this means they stand an OK chance at a win vs caster)

Elemental elders now hit about 1/4 instead of 0.25/4 which it seemed (still no way to kill an elemental elder as a caster)

Human Ninja was about the same as elemental elders hit them about 1/4 maybe a bit less (this used to be slightly in favor of ninja but now its pretty set win for ninja)

I didnt get to test against a lizard or drake ninja but im assuming they have a slight advantage over chanters.


This isnt too worrying for chanters since they will be getting some more damage from staves as you stated.



I can see how the tables have turned race wise with int no longer accounting for penetration. Before people used gnomes because they had better penetration (hit more) and accepted they had the lowest health and didnt really work for oads. Now with everyone hitting the same penetration wise and only having slightly less damage I think its a better choice to take the extra 120-240hp to sacrifice a little damage.


Again the system isnt done maybe to make up for loss of penetration damage/buffs per int point will be a bit higher? maybe staff damage will be multiplied off int who knows.


Anyways just some feedback prob not too helpful since the system is incomplete. but if the goal was to narrow the MR range and nerf gnomes down a bit I think its mission accomplished.


I think its posted somewhere but could we get damage (blast) ac (stoneskin) and str (power) per int?

[NiteHawk]

Yeah i'll post it later.

Per int though if it was more then instead of raising the max we'd sacrifice the per point to start and scale it to the current max. For example if power gave 2str with 10 int and 4 str with 20 int. then I'd do 0.5 str with 10 int and 4 str with 20 int.

The pen loss doesn't really affect anything because the penetration rates are completely different. Everyone gained the same penetration, it was just fluff that wasn't needed atm and helped balanced out the rates by not having so many variables.


Just like races with physical theres going to be downsides of some races vs others now with this method rather then gnomes being the goto on everything.

Blast is 7.8474 damage per int point at level 25 not including div bonuses. So 180 damage with 23int, 156 with 20int. To me that seems fair though. With around 14% div bonus as the current max it becomes 8.867562 per point, so 204 damage with 23 int and 177 damage with 20 int.

Technically that's more lost then most physical based weapons. Something we might wanna do is give them a little more damage at 23 int but we'd need to look at it.


Elemental Druid with 23 wisdom has a HR of 38%. so in between 1 and 2 hits per round i guess that one would be. 24wisdom is 35%.

[anthriel]

So having a caster that is not a GNOME is now a thing, though if you want maximum damage and highest MR you would go for GNOME still. I can see other races with 20/21 int being a thing now though.

rather then gnomes being the goto on everything.

I'm unsure which of us is disconnected with the reality of recent enchanter trends but i really dont see gnomes as being the race of preference for enchanters at all... in fact most of the ppl who i know with gnome chanters i believe made them early on (probably thinking of RoK game dynamics) and i rarely see a gnome sorc created nowadays (most ppl will create an Ele now)....

i personally have a gnome enchanter... and there isnt a day that goes by playing it that i dont wish i made the chanter with a 20/21 int race instead... and i'd do almost anything to be able to change its race into something with more HP (and happily sacrifice +1 INT/WIS to achieve that - because there is little point in doing marginally more damage if you die in 1 round from groupfight targeting or OAD double-taps before you can damage anything).

Just wanted to voice my opinion on this as you appear (to me) to be operating under the misunderstanding that gnomes are the race of choice for enchanters when really most veteran players appear to have already realized that 20/21 int chanters were "a thing" (purely because of the importance of HP in EO) long before these MR changes.

All i can say is that I hope the free respecs we finally get when AGI is changed will allow for race changes because otherwise i'm just hazarding a guess that there's going to be a lot of discouraged players out there...

[daedroth]

... blah blah blah ...

Yeh I don't think gnomes are the go to race for chanter anymore either. Even when they were though, I never made a gome sorcy.
Made one recently ironically though

[Lateralus]

Yea unfortunately it's looking a bit rough for gnomes they didnt really make a anything good besides chanters/necros (high wis gnome druids used to be a thing but elemental made that a no factor)

Int doesn't matter a ton for most healing spells so we don't see gnome healers.

Int isn't huge for hide so we don't see gnome thieves or slayers anymore really.

For casters now with pen loss they really only do +8 damage a hit and a fraction of buff power over elf while elf has +1 end and +1 agi.

Or as suggested above you can lose 1int and have an elemental with 180 more hp.


I do like that everyone will have pen and things will be more useful but maybe int should matter a bit more for pen that was lost on that high int or maybe gnomes should be looked at because they somewhat just lost their only somewhat good class and even that was just slightly above average. I agree most initially made gnomes thinking they would have a big spells bonus like rok I think even before this update I'm not sure they were the race of choice for sorcs like elementals are for druids or half orcs are for slayers.

[daedroth]

Yeh, when the AGL changes, give gnomes an extra AGL point Small and dodge they become!

[anthriel]

Yeh, when the AGL changes, give gnomes an extra AGL point Small and dodge they become!

This could help... though id probably still want to change away from gnome if i possible... The other option is to raise their racial profile to allow 23 int and 23 wis (before the +1).... making them even more into a "glass cannon" race (i mean Horcs have 24 str so why not have a race with really high int/wis... esp if they are pansys who fall over and die easily).... still probably wouldnt choose em again tho