Assassin Dual Wield Bonus

[Folder]

That just seems like crazy rng. Tomb has done 600 dmg to me in one round and thats 1 person.

Not trying to be a dick but was the priest also getting healed by a guard? Was the priest stoneskinned? Did you try switching to a different target or splitting dps to make heals less efficient? With 5 attackers you have a ton of dps possible in one round.

You're telling me that 5 people attacking a target never did more than 25% of their hit point pool? That's nuts man. 1 backstab is likely more thab 25%. Hell 1 roundhouse can be more than 25%.

[killa]

tomb was there ask him. ask spaz, gyko, myself, deehok. ask reaper. shits wacko doesn't matter if its your class, fairness in the game is important to the balance of the game for everyone

[Folder]

I'm asking for details to help NH balance things.

If a cleric is invincible its a problem, but we need more details you know? Like I said not trying to be a dick but saying "shit is whack" and this is "fuckin retarded" is not usable data.

I fully agree balance is important but let's have a real discussion with data points.

Were 5 people focusing the priest? Any magic users? Was priest stoneskinned? Were there extra heals on the priest? Did you try focused target switches? What race was the priest?

I'm on your side here man.

[Lateralus]

I do feel heals are a little op. They were like that in Rok as well. Hence when a priest joined a tgc they only got 1-2 heals for the whole fight (or it would be impossible to kill them).

Heals are even more powerful in this game and the hp pool is higher making them even harder to kill.

I'm not sure what could be done but it would be nice if all classes could 1v1 using all their skills and still be killable.

It's pretty much impossible to round anyone bc hp pools are a lot higher than damage output which is fine but it's nearly impossible to kill a priest or guard because they can just widdle away at you while they heal any damage done.

Not sure what the answer is here but don't worry we are actively working on making the game better and as you can see we take player input so you guys are heard just be descriptive and have data.

[Reaper]

This is an odd thread to be talking about priests, but what he said happened was true. After constant attacking by both parties, not one person died and everyone was healthy or slightly. It was to the point that one party just gave up and left because it was going no where lol. I'm not talking two or three rounds here, but a lot. Now our priest was stoneskinned, and she was being hit quite a lot. She even said she was on the edge of her seat the whole time. It could just be attributed to luck I suppose, but no one died. Their healer wasn't even 25 and our whole party of 25's couldn't take him down. I even tried focusing someone else to put pressure on his heals(which was Killa) and being a magic user I was hitting him a lot. It made no difference lol.

We were all kinda wondering how it was even possible. It doesn't seem like priests are OP, and I don't want to say that they are. I will say that in this case they certainly were though. Now whether it is extremely unlikely circumstances or the need for balancing isn't for me to say.

[NiteHawk]

The damage will be as I spoke about, Your missing about 2min-4 max probably on daggers which I think is still a good deal. I am honestly not going to go in details again, read this post: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=181&start=30#p6724 .. I am pretty SURE i even use a bone dagger as an example in my leveling calculations. I really don't think slayers are the problem here. Not having the best weapons does hurt though. Specially when everyone doesn't have it. You can claim for everyone it might be missing 20 to 35 damage on average, but in a group of 6 that is ALOT of damage missing. Per person thats 80 to 140 damage per round. For slayers, its more like 160-280 per round (on two backstabs calculated). But even if its half that damage from missing half the time, its still alot. Though you have to take into effect armor/etc/etc.

The thing I can see with priests is since they heal for 350 a pop, it means they heal for 1400. 1400 might not sound like alot, but with SS and about 100 armor its more like 1600 damage on self without taking into account armor absorbs. If it is under level 25, it is missing a heal pretty much, so more like 1250. It might be hard for a group to bring one down. It probably needs to be looked at and adjusted. We never really did this yet. In ROK it was the same way though as Lat said. I'm talking about Precrash though, not postcrash with the AGI destruction.

But obviously if the priest doesn't die, no one will die. Heavier armor will also reduce the damage taken, which was happening here too I'm sure with SS etc. However this is universal, I.E. if a slayer is only doing 600 damage instead of 700 damage against a heavy armor user, then the person with a blade is also going to be doing less too. I think this is overall OK that armor has a passive reduction. People can get fuzzy that on heavier targets they dont deal heavier damage with a slayer, but ALL classes, not just slayers get hit with the damage reduction effect on heavy classes.

When we speak about damage absorption, with 100% armor its going to happen about 50% of the time. Body armor itself only deflects about 35% and the shield is another 15% right now. THe actual absorption is 0-40% damage with body armor, and 0-60% with shield. On average, with this basis, you can say that's another 25% absorbed I'd say, or around on average. With a priest you are probably looking at soaking up 2000 damage on average because of healing.

I think half the issue lies with how armor works now. It isn't as crap as ROK used to be. You will deflect or absorb alot, and then there is passive absorption. I dont' think the damage is bad, but we kept the healing also at the same level which might be bad because of the inreased armor effectiveness. The thing is, it needs to be balanced. Priests cant just be useless in a group of 6 (party max) either.

Though I do not think in a 1vs1 a priest should die, it's just how it goes with them. But a party of 6 should pressure them more. I don't think the hitrate is bad, but maybe all aid needs a reduction overall. Let us say around 300 with 22 INT or even lower. It's something though I need to be on and test.

Again, the reason why I am worried about this is because damage values are going to get ramped up a little with OAD weapons. It might suddenly make priests useless if its too much damage being taken. If the priest was on his edge would he still be surviving if there was another 200-300 damage hitting him (Thinking increased damage if everyone had OAD weapons, and party of 6)? Or would he have died with no chance?

Also screaming about stuff without giving proper information will cause me to ignore it. It doesn't help me or anyone here when you don't give information and don't do it in a constructive way... AKA what they had, what you had, what levels if there wasnt 25ers, damages, etc etc is all nice to instead of 'shits wacko'. This gives me absolutely no information on how I can change things mate.

P.S. Please open another thread about heals guys if its needed.

P.P.S I guess in ROK most people had two alts or more too, which meant parties were probably double sized, and killing priests was tough then still. We can do some tests tonight or something when I'm around if I can.

[killa]

the priests are gonna say their underpowered so whats the point in arguing, I humble concede from the argument. better than being dogged all day by everyone because I said shits wack lmfao

[NiteHawk]

the priests are gonna say their underpowered so whats the point in arguing, I humble concede from the argument. better than being dogged all day by everyone because I said shits wack lmfao

But several people here have stated that they are a bit overpowered. I don't understand your logic here. I am asking for data and constructive posts on this. This isn't an attack, this is for the benefit of the game. Surely you can understand why I want proper data over it no?

I also agree that priests are a bit overpowered. But we need to see what a good limit for their heals are. We also need to test with proper weapons and the like too.

[killa]

I don't have any logic here, I posted my comments about it due to my experience with it. I have no other data I'm not a priest. I just wanted to bring to light a situation so that the people able to give more information can do so.

[NiteHawk]

I don't have any logic here, I posted my comments about it due to my experience with it. I have no other data I'm not a priest. I just wanted to bring to light a situation so that the people able to give more information can do so.

What characters did you guys have? (Levels and Classes).

Who was it you were fighting? (Not sure you'd know the level but any information).

The reason why I am asking this though is I want to replicate it in a simulation area.