Race Stat Changes

[NiteHawk]

Yea I think they are fine with an extra pool and or a bonus. I wish we could give them something other than armor since 2 other races already get that but not sure what to give?

I know we don't wanna give them more power as a healer so less Fiz is prob out.

Maybe 1-2 hit rate or dodge rate although I know you'd just rather have agi act.

1% crit sounds messy when dealing with other crit stuff

Could do like a 2-4 physical damage reduction like dwarf have spell reduction of 10. That kinda makes healers better tho.

Could do like at night or underground 2% more damage.

Could just give them that extra 1 pool stat and bump their chr up to 18 allowing them to stack higher chr hp / mp bonus and make knights a bit better and a long shot ranger.

Maybe more hp recovery like suggested.

Maybe a search and hide bonus?

Just some ideas to work with.

Search/hide bonus probably really does nothing and might be weird skillset as it only benefits some classes and not all. Not sure how I feel about that. I don't think they should get spell reduction because goblins get it, and it makes them very similar and we should try to space these races out a bit. Agreed with extra crit, also specific to classes too which is meh.

1 pool and 2 char is OK, it doesn't make them completely good just by doing that but it would help out a little. HP recovery is okay. HR and DR make no sense and if you give them that anyways you shadow making a ling so that is probably a bad idea too.

I think honestly they aren't terrible with the HP boost that they will still get. If you look at saurians vs them, they are quite similar. I don't think they need much to be honest. We might be looking at this incorrectly because we also have adjusted other races too.

I made changes to #11, check them out now. I think we are fairly close.

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About INT mattering more for healing...

INT needs to have a linear scale, having a random scale that changes based on int point is often confusing to people and can be problematic. But again that should be posted elsewhere, we 'do' need to talk about magic scaling but it's going to be lost here and we're in to deep to change topics, need to focus on this one 8)

DE's with 19 END overshadow a couple races as it stands though. To be honest I think it's okay and I think we can probably test it out soon.

Will there be a 21 end race. I've seen it brought up about humans being possibly 21 end. This would give a wider spectrum of possible end choices

Not with the HP formula changes. Changing the HP formula plus giving HE/Humans END too is too much.

[Folder]

I think #11 is looking good and agree on DE's not really needing much else. Compared to Ling you get +2 str at the cost of 1 agi, a fair tradeoff.

I don't think DE needs anything else after looking at it all more closely, unless it's just a minor thing and mostly for flavor.

Is it safe to assume every race that has allocation points changed will get a respec?

[Eld]

Bit concerned these changes are going to make halflings a bit OP in comparison to half elf/human/etc. especially with the agi stat getting a bit of a boost.

The only classes you tend to use half elf/human/etc. for atm is cleric, paladin, bard and maybe ranger and sorc/necro.

Halfling will now be best for all of these.
10,23,19,20,20,11 OR 10,24,18,20,20,11 for cleric/sorc/necro just seems to be much better than other combinations available.

Halfling will also make Elves useless for bards/rangers due to having the same str/end/chr, but having higher agi.


I'll try to do a comparison in a short while of what would be the best options for different classes if #11 is implemented, but it does seem to be wonky to me

[Folder]

Lings are perhaps outshadowing elves for rangers/bards, but I mean I don't think we achieve 100% every-race-is-equal here. You could knock ling down 1 CHR to even that out, if desired.

For other classes:
18 23 18 20 20 22 Ling

vs

19 21 19 20 20 21 Half elf

We are giving up 2 AGI for 1 END. This is debatable imo, but I think it's close enough that this does not make lings instantly better than half elves for caster classes. I'd still pick half elf here but I will say that halfling makes a good enough choice now. I think that's the goal though!

Still going to pick elf or gnome for casters as well, I don't really feel the extra AGI outweighs losing INT.

[Lateralus]

Bit concerned these changes are going to make halflings a bit OP in comparison to half elf/human/etc. especially with the agi stat getting a bit of a boost.

The only classes you tend to use half elf/human/etc. for atm is cleric, paladin, bard and maybe ranger and sorc/necro.

Halfling will now be best for all of these.
10,23,19,20,20,11 OR 10,24,18,20,20,11 for cleric/sorc/necro just seems to be much better than other combinations available.

Halfling will also make Elves useless for bards/rangers due to having the same str/end/chr, but having higher agi.


I'll try to do a comparison in a short while of what would be the best options for different classes if #11 is implemented, but it does seem to be wonky to me

I wouldnt take halfling sorc or necro over elf of half elf I dont think most would. As for cleric I think id still favor elf for more int/mana pool with pretty much the same stats 1 agi isnt a huge deal. its only getting buffed .25% I highly doubt anyone will even notice the changes between 22 and 23 agi. Maybe between 19agi and 24agi but even then its 1.25%? again not a huge deal.


As for rangers and bards yea they might be better than elf and half elf but half elf and elf are better at sorc and necro so i dont think its a huge deal? I think drake is the best ranger anyways so halfling pretty much has best bard going for it. I dont think thats that bad.

Note: I have 0 halflings so no stake in them just looking for balance.

[NiteHawk]

Lings are perhaps outshadowing elves for rangers/bards, but I mean I don't think we achieve 100% every-race-is-equal here. You could knock ling down 1 CHR to even that out, if desired.

For other classes:
18 23 18 20 20 22 Ling

vs

19 21 19 20 20 21 Half elf

We are giving up 2 AGI for 1 END. This is debatable imo, but I think it's close enough that this does not make lings instantly better than half elves for caster classes. I'd still pick half elf here but I will say that halfling makes a good enough choice now. I think that's the goal though!

Still going to pick elf or gnome for casters as well, I don't really feel the extra AGI outweighs losing INT.

We need to see how magic works per INT point too, with healing etc, it probably can spike a little but I don't think it's too far off what ti should be now, but that will prob be done when we work weapons into magic damage.


Anyways, let's try to get this wrapped up. I think we are close here anyways.

[Styx]

I love lingd, gnomes and goblins. Why, back in the day I had to have small people to do oads, otherwise I would have only had 20 end plus. More life so I could do pvp stuff. But to reiterate. We had small people races only for certain oads. And if we do the small races then we better keep it going.

[Dan]

About proposal #11

I feel like taking away one alloc point for Saurians and Drakes is a bit too much a nerf.

They already have small MR, reducing their END is not enough?

[FrostSlayer]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but with all of the stat changes flying around I figured it would be ok. How does the natural AC of some races interact with absorb and deflect mechanics? Does it only affect absorb chances, or is it both, or does it only apply as a physical damage reduction percentage? I was always wondering this and thought I would ask. Thanks.

[Lateralus]

About proposal #11

I feel like taking away one alloc point for Saurians and Drakes is a bit too much a nerf.

They already have small MR, reducing their END is not enough?

Well when they lose and end they will have an extra point pretty much.

Right now lizard can build a 22 23 19 10 14 10
After the change they will b 22 23 18 10 14 10 (with losing an end and allocation point)

I guess I could see them keeping an allocation but really on lizard what are you going to do? Toss it in int?

Same with drake even if you go 12wis 14chr you don't gain and hp just mp.


That said I don't think it would hurt them keeping the allocation point since they lost an end I just don't think it makes a big deal.